$ sensors radeon-pci-0100 Adapter: PCI adapter temp1: +68.0°C k10temp-pci-00c3 Adapter: PCI adapter temp1: +45.1°C (high = +70.0°C) (crit = +72.0°C, hyst = +70.0°C) On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 7:07 PM, Brien Dieterle wrote: > Well, it might be protecting your computer but if it is too low it will > just be annoying. > You still need to run sensors and get those numbers if you haven't yet: > > https://askubuntu.com/questions/15832/how-do-i-get-the-cpu-temperature > > If your machine is legitimately overheating you need to address that with > fans and ventilation, etc. > > On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:59 PM, Michael wrote: > >> if there is a shutoff point you did say disable it? >> >> >> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:56 PM, Brien Dieterle wrote: >> >>> Well, you're on the right track. Try to isolate whether glmark alone >>> can crash it, or if you need stress as well. Then try opening up your >>> case and point a fan in there. >>> Also don't forget to check the BIOS for thermal management events that >>> might be causing the shutdown/reboot. >>> >>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:52 PM, Michael wrote: >>> >>>> never mind..... I ran glmark around 5 minutes and then stress. that >>>> crashed the machine! Not a nice reboot (like what it does with dt) but a >>>> power failure outage, >>>> >>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:41 PM, Michael wrote: >>>> >>>>> and if glmark2 doesn't crash it run stress the same amount of time? >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:37 PM, Michael wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> how long do I let glmark2's pretty horse rotate? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:36 PM, Michael wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> okay >>>>>>> ` >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:10 PM, Brien Dieterle >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'd wait. If stress alone doesn't crash, run glmark2 by itself. >>>>>>>> If glmark2 doesn't crash, run them both at the same time. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Michael wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> run this now or after stress completes? >>>>>>>>> ? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:59 PM, Brien Dieterle >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Well, not yet ;-). If it doesn't crash, you might need to >>>>>>>>>> stress the graphics card as well with one of these tools: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> https://www.pcsuggest.com/gpu-benchmarking-and-stress-testin >>>>>>>>>> g-in-linux/ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> So maybe kick off both stress and >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> glmark2 --run-forever >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Michael >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> if it doesn't crash I'll start hounding the darktable forums. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:45 PM, Michael >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Just started..... lets see what happens >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:36 PM, Brien Dieterle < >>>>>>>>>>>> briend@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Forget darktable for now. Did you run stress test for more >>>>>>>>>>>>> than 10 seconds? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> This will run a stress test for 30 minutes: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> stress --cpu 8 --io 4 --vm 2 --hdd 2 --timeout 1800s >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> If you can get it to crash with just this stress program, then >>>>>>>>>>>>> it has nothing to do with darktable >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 2:24 PM, Michael >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have no sensors running and as for it panicing when warm >>>>>>>>>>>>>> sometimes it panics after I run dt 2 minutes after it had been shut down an >>>>>>>>>>>>>> hour and doesn't panic even though dt had run10 minutes. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 4:31 PM, Brien Dieterle < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> briend@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Check your bios settings for hardware monitoring and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> temperature limits. You may have it set with a maximum temperature so the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machine panics when it's just warm. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Try raising this number or disabling the feature entirely >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But first check your sensors by installing a temperature >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> monitoring program >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 30, 2017 1:04 PM, "Michael" wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is sooo ify! I just ran it for like 10 minutes with no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> crashes whereas before I had just started the computer and ran dt for 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minutes and it crashed. Then I restarted and I had a repeat performance of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the 2 minute thing. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:38 PM, Michael >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $ stress --cpu 8 --io 4 --vm 2 --vm-bytes 128M --timeout >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 10s >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stress: info: [7571] dispatching hogs: 8 cpu, 4 io, 2 vm, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 0 hdd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stress: info: [7571] successful run completed in 10s >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know what that was suppossed to tell me but there >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it is. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:36 PM, Michael >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am experiencing no slowness. It is like the days where >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you had a power switch on the back of your computer... or it is like a hard >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reboot. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Stephen Partington < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cryptworks@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OpenCL in darktable mainly impacts rendering. it should >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have no effect on on system or ram consumption unless you are experiencing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slowness during render cycles. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 12:21 PM, Michael < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bmike1@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You know.... I'm having trouble running darktable. It >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seems that after I start it it runs a few minutes and then reboots the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> computer. Probably because I do not have a GPU (I don't think). Then I saw >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this thread and thought that I'd give that a try. So it seems I can not run >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chrome and darktable at the same time. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ___ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 'lspci' shows that my graphics card is : >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] RV770 [Radeon HD 4850] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and 'lspci|grep gpu' returned an empty set >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (if I did that correctly) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so I suppose the cheapest way to fix this is to get a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gpu.... correct? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Carruth, Rusty < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty.Carruth@smartm.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In my experience, it’s almost always Firefox taking >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all of memory. (Or Chrome, or whatever web browser you’re using). >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with Mr B, run top or htop and see what’s, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well, on top ;-) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: SMART_HRS_RGB] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rusty Carruth | Customer Support | *rusty.carruth@smarth.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * | http://www.smarth.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: linkedin] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> twitter] See the new M4[image: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cid:image004.jpg@01D348E7.AF930710] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> See us on Storage Search >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.storagesearch.com/smart2.html >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 510-624-5391 <(510)%20624-5391> | Fax: 480-926-5579 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <(480)%20926-5579> | 1325 N. Fiesta Blvd. Suite >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 101 Gilbert, Az. 85233 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *From:* PLUG-discuss [mailto:plug-discuss-bounces@l >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ists.phxlinux.org] *On Behalf Of *Michael Butash >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Sent:* Sunday, October 29, 2017 10:05 AM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: computer slow >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If I ever have that, it's usually because of something >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a memory leak, or desktop graphic compositing is degrading over time. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Before you reboot, see if you can ssh into it from >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another computer and check htop (or just top all you have), see if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> something is consuming all your memory or cpu. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Desktop compositors are all shite from what I can tell >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (including windoze), they're all just a varying degree of broken when you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> push them, or just have a slow (or buggy) video card. Depending on your >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> desktop environment of choice, try turning down graphics options, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disabling the compositor all together to see if it helps stability. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -mb >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 3:41 AM, Michael < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bmike1@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm almost certain that in my bag of tricks I had >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instructions on 'resetting' my computer when it started acting weird but I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> can't find them. Riddle me this: I try to leave the computer on 24/7 (maybe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I shouldn't do that) and twice so far I come up to it and it is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-responsive or really slow to respond. Anyone know how to fix this? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> man/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> man/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> snooze button. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stephen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>>>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>>>>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> :-)~MIKE~(-: >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------- >>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>>> >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------- >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >>> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> :-)~MIKE~(-: >> >> --------------------------------------------------- >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: >> http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss >> > > > --------------------------------------------------- > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.phxlinux.org > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: > http://lists.phxlinux.org/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss > -- :-)~MIKE~(-: